TBH his podcast just got boring before then. I had pretty much stopped listening because I got bored with Joe interrupting the guest to talk about apes or something like that. He didn't really seem to make an effort to understand his guests a lot, especially when it was something he might be politically against. It just became uninteresting. I forgot who it was that he had on, but they were talking about how in another world where team sports were gender-mixed instead of what they are now, we'd value different things in teams (like the different qualities brought by the different types of players, or their ability to work together to succeed, not just worship at individual superstar athletes as is common now) and Joe was just like "but guys are the best, I don't understand". Like, it wasn't really a hard concept to grasp, even if you don't think sports teams should be gender-mixed.